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View Poll Results: Is Global warming caused by human co2?
Yes 25 67.57%
No 12 32.43%
Voters: 37. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-06-2007, 06:22 PM   #1
Polar
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Default Global Warming - True or False?

Heres some facts on Global warming. Personally i think the fact that we cause global warming is untrue and people believe it thorough manipulation caused by mass media. But make your own mind up. I thought i would give a different opinion, as most people believe it now.


-Every Climatologist will tell you the Earth's temperature has been much hotter and colder than it is now.

-There was an Ice Age and it warmed up, there was a Mini Ice Age just 500 years ago and it has been warming up ever since. The Industrial Revolution was not around during those periods.

-NASA reports because of Solar Flares the Sun is the hottest it has been in over 100 years. There are no cars on the sun.

-Global warming is causing ice to melt on Mars. There are no cars on Mars.

-Thousands and thousands of studies and experiments prove that more carbon dioxide produces better fruits, vegetables, trees and almost any sort of plant life.

-Most of the temperature increase happened before 1940 (Before most carbon dioxide was released by cars and factories)

-The hot year of 1998 was caused by El Nino.

-Joining the Kyoto Protocol would cost the U.S. approximately $400 Billion every year and have virtually no effect on earths temperature.





And the stupid thing is, that Al Gore gives incorrect information! He says that the more co2, the warmer the earth gets. When its the other way around! When the earth gets warmer(as it does colder) the sea gives off more co2. Im not denying that global warming is happening, but its not our fault! BBC go to Antartica in the summer and say "this is out fault, look, it is melting" - But its summer, they do melt in summer! You may then be thinking that the ice caps are smaller than a few years ago - this is true. But the ice caps were far smaller 10 years ago when less human co2 was produced. How can we be causing global warming when the eart was far far warmer in the medeval warm period. And there wasn't any factories around then!



Anyway, rant over. I just get pissed off when every single day, i get told to recylce and turn down my heating. I do recycle, but because its good to re-use things, not because we are all going to die because my granny and her bingo mates didn't turn down her heating by 1oC last Tuesday.




http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...62022478442170

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Old 06-06-2007, 06:37 PM   #2
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Well luckily, George Bush seems to agree with you, and is currently putting the smackdown on those narrow-minded liberals. You can read more about that here. This is the wrong section for this discussion though, because you're not actually talking about the climate of Damien Rice, I think it's more befitting to the everything else section.
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Old 06-06-2007, 06:57 PM   #3
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Voted yes.

I don't care about what Al Gore says, he's just a politcian. But when David Attenborough joined the 'human-caused' camp, that gave me a nudge. I'm not a climate expert, but almost all of them are saying that we are causing the Warming, and I think they konw it better.
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Old 06-06-2007, 07:14 PM   #4
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Not sure what to vote, IMO humans are partially responsible but not 100%. In my opinion, mostly it has to do with the sun and its cycles, the heat coming from the sun cannot be constant, it fluctuates up and down, and that has a major impact on the whole solar system.

But I also think we're making a big mess, so for me it's not a black/white thing. That's why I say we are partially responsible...
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Old 06-06-2007, 07:16 PM   #5
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i'm sayn no related to the specific question... Al Gore is a moron, so lets not go there

but, i've seen both arguments made by both sides that global warming is happening, and isn't, and it's hard to come to a conclusion, but i do feel that the pollution is effecting our world in more ways than one.

fact is tho.. if it really is happening, no one is going to do anything about it... people won't change until it's too late, and everything will fall to pieces... unless we run out of oil and bring in those nice electric cars they show in "who killed the electric car".. which btw is a very interesting movie/documentary.
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Old 06-06-2007, 07:38 PM   #6
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i said yes cause we certainly aren't helping... especially the USA...
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Old 06-06-2007, 07:56 PM   #7
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I'd really rather not vote. I'm not a climatologist, geologist or an astrophysicist. I'm simply not well educated enough to make an informed argument. However in the spirit of the prevailing attitude towards a potential nuclear war; I'm of the opinion that if there's even a chance that we could destroy every living thing on the planet, then it's worth fighting to avoid it. Even if we disagree about the cause.

Also in our list of achievements as a species, we can count the eradication of smallpox. So it's not as if we're not able to collectively fight against something we know will kill us.
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Old 06-06-2007, 08:00 PM   #8
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i was looking for the maybe option, didn't vote.
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Old 06-06-2007, 08:25 PM   #9
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You'll be hard pressed to find a decent, independent scientist who will agree with you I am afraid. The simple fact of the mater is that human activity is causing a fluctuation in the world's temperature like nothing ever seen before in the geological record of this planet.
But allow me to address your concerns:

-Every Climatologist will tell you the Earth's temperature has been much hotter and colder than it is now.
This is entirely true. However global warming is not about the earth getting hotter - it is about the rate of change, the world is heating up at a far greater rate than ever before, this is an unstable and volatile situation causing severe extremes of weather (not necessarily simply warmer weather). In the last one hundred years the number of natural disasters has increased dramatically due to the changing nature of our climate.

-There was an Ice Age and it warmed up, there was a Mini Ice Age just 500 years ago and it has been warming up ever since. The Industrial Revolution was not around during those periods.
again - the fact that global temperatures are getting warmer is not the problem at all. it is the rate of change that needs to be examined

-NASA reports because of Solar Flares the Sun is the hottest it has been in over 100 years. There are no cars on the sun.
several things here - NASA is funded by the American government. Said government funds scientists not to investigate global warming but to prove that it isn't happening. Nothing that NASA says can be really trusted. Especially as they have an active interest in proving it doesn't exist as they are contributing to the problem.
The UN international panel on climate change has stated that human activity is directly responsible for the rate of change in the Earth's temperatures.
I'll take the independent view.
Also, while it may be true the that the solar flares are hotter than normal that is not much of a problem. the probem comes when we have holes in our ozone layer so the stronger rays can get through. and how did the hole get there? Human activity.


-Global warming is causing ice to melt on Mars. There are no cars on Mars.
Neither is there ice on Mars. So I don't think it can be melting. All the Haughton-Mars Project of 2003 found on Mars was rivets in the rock that looked like they could have been formed by running water at some point in the distant past. Leading to a hope that once upon a time there was life on Mars. they never found any ice.

-Thousands and thousands of studies and experiments prove that more carbon dioxide produces better fruits, vegetables, trees and almost any sort of plant life.
I must admit I don't know anything about this - but the concern over global warming is not about plants really. The concern is for the wildlife of the Arctic and Antarctic regions and for rising sea levels which will lead to flooding and more natural disasters - leading to Human loss of life. The concern also is that, as the hole in the o-zone layer widens so too do our changes of contracting skin, and other forms of, cancer.

-Most of the temperature increase happened before 1940 (Before most carbon dioxide was released by cars and factories)
the temperature continues to increase at a far higher rate than in the past today. And prior to the 1940s saw an awful lot of oil and coal burning too.

-The hot year of 1998 was caused by El Nino.
Global warming leads to more natural disasters. El Nino in 1998 was a natural disaster. 1998 was not the hottest year on record anyway. That was last year.

-Joining the Kyoto Protocol would cost the U.S. approximately $400 Billion every year and have virtually no effect on earths temperature.
Not true, it would have a dramatic effect on slowing the rate of increase, which is what it's all about. And I, personally, would far prefer ol' Georgie Pie to spend his money on saving our planet than invading countries his daddy didn't like the look of and flying anyone who gave him cheek away on extraordinary rendition flights to lovely hotels in guantanamo bay.
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Old 06-06-2007, 08:41 PM   #10
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isn't global warming enhanced greenhouse effect which is a natural occurence?

could it not be fair to say we furtherly encourage global warming?
wouldnt that be more accurate.
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Old 06-06-2007, 09:20 PM   #11
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-Every Climatologist will tell you the Earth's temperature has been much hotter and colder than it is now.

ME: (Depending how you believe the world began, this is the Scientific View) Look at what period of time in which you are talking about. At one point in time, the world was molten rock, sure it would be hotter then but there was no life then. As the atmosphere took shape and earth cooled, life came about in the form of micro-organisms (The work of Prof. Urey). Photosynthetic life started producing Oxygen and life took hold from there. So yes...the world may be documented to be hotter than it is now, but there was no life.

-There was an Ice Age and it warmed up, there was a Mini Ice Age just 500 years ago and it has been warming up ever since. The Industrial Revolution was not around during those periods.

Me: The earth does have cycles. But from the data scientists have collected, the recent increase of temperature and the speed in which it has increased has been unparalleled. Given a slow change in time, animals and plants can adapt, but it has already been shown that changes in climate have thrown off natural cycles. (Birds breeding times and insect breeding times don't overlap anymore, causing birds to die off and insect populations to be uncontrolled.

-NASA reports because of Solar Flares the Sun is the hottest it has been in over 100 years. There are no cars on the sun.

Me: The sun is a totally different science. The sun is essentially a large fire ball and solar flares happen on the sun all the time. It is a burning ball of hydrogen and helium. The science of Global Warming/Climate Change on is that the more CO2 or other heat trapping gases (known as Green house gases) there is in the atmosphere, the more heat from the sun it traps. The Earth isn't producing it's own heat to sustain life, it is trapping a fraction of the sun's heat that touches the earth to heat the earth at a life sustaining level.

-Global warming is causing ice to melt on Mars. There are no cars on Mars.
Me: Greenhouse Gases may be responsible for that, CO2 does trap gases. Co2 can come from other sources besides cars. But that is not the same science again, as with the Sun example. Also, the problem with Global Warming on earth is the fact that it negatively effects life, so Mars is hardly a comparison.

-Thousands and thousands of studies and experiments prove that more carbon dioxide produces better fruits, vegetables, trees and almost any sort of plant life.

Me: Can you cite one example? CO2 has a bigger effect than just producing "better fruits vegetables, trees" as you say. Hypothetically, what good does more oxygen in the atmosphere do for us? We have become the organisms we are because of the way the world is. What I'm trying to say is, you can only inhale so much oxygen, how would that make you better? Plants can't infinitely soak up all the CO2, they have natural limits and needs. The true effects of CO2 can be see in the water. Excess CO2 in the water actually causes the water's pH to become more acidic. Thus effecting natural ocean life, such as the coral reefs. If you have ever had an aquarium, you know how important pH is for the wellness of your fish, plants, or corals.

-Most of the temperature increase happened before 1940 (Before most carbon dioxide was released by cars and factories)
Me: From what time period are you talking about and what was the temperature change?

-The hot year of 1998 was caused by El Nino.

Me: 10 of the hottest years on record was in the past 14 years. 2005 being the hottest, not 1998.

-Joining the Kyoto Protocol would cost the U.S. approximately $400 Billion every year and have virtually no effect on earths temperature.

Me: How so? The Kyoto Protocol may not be THE answer, but it couldn't hurt to be a part of the answer. How are you going to place the lives of humans, plants, and animals in the form of money?




And the stupid thing is, that Al Gore gives incorrect information! He says that the more co2, the warmer the earth gets. When its the other way around! When the earth gets warmer(as it does colder) the sea gives off more co2. Im not denying that global warming is happening, but its not our fault! BBC go to Antartica in the summer and say "this is out fault, look, it is melting" - But its summer, they do melt in summer! You may then be thinking that the ice caps are smaller than a few years ago - this is true. But the ice caps were far smaller 10 years ago when less human co2 was produced. How can we be causing global warming when the eart was far far warmer in the medeval warm period. And there wasn't any factories around then!


1) CO2 does cause the earth to get warmer. There isn't much scientific debate on that.
2) The ocean has been acting as a sponge for years. That is why the true effects of global warming has not been felt quite yet. It is claimed by professors at the Scripts institute of Oceanography that if all CO2 was stopped today (from cars, power plants) the ocean would continue to release the CO2 we put into it, back into the atmosphere to form equilibrium. So realyl the effects of CO2 will be felt long after we stop global emissions.
3) If you don't deny the fact that it's happening, how can you come to grips with the moral implications of it? There will be those effected by drought, flooding, lack of water, disease, displacement, and
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Old 06-06-2007, 09:42 PM   #12
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Default Poll: Does This Thread belong in the Everything Else Forum?

I vote yes

this should be in a different forum
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Old 06-06-2007, 10:30 PM   #13
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i voted No

because i tend to lead towards No but don't claim to be an expert
however the same people that are telling me that the world is getting warmer because of us also told me that the amazon rainforest would be gone by the year 2000 and before me they were argueing for global cooling in the 70s.

edit:
and i'll never use those dangerous new light bulbs that are filled with mercury.

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Old 06-06-2007, 10:47 PM   #14
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Ok, well heres what i know. the earth itself produces alot more CO2 gas than humans. and i mean a hell of alot more. and i believe on that basis and the basis of the suns heat being hotter the last decade or so is all the reason for the "worlds" problems with global warming.

However! the problem we face as humans, is a more lets say "localised" threat. i mean lets not be stupid, if you live in a city you will suffer greater from pollution, and the effect on humans will be worse and those human poulated areas will suffer, but as for the ice caps and whatnot, we contribute so little to it that it isnt really something we can change.

The whole thing of green tax was basically the government paying a scientist to gather ststistics to say its our fault so the government could tax us on it. Do you thin that with the smoking ban the government are just gonna sit back and let all that excess tax disapear. of course not, insted of just cancer stick smokers paying a tax, we all have to do so to make up for it.

So yeah, im not in any doubt, that our co2 emission do have a negative affect on US buit not really on the planet as a whole.

The earth and its cycils are so amazingly clever, i mean look a tthe facts, glbal warming will not and has never destroyed the eart, no ice age has ever killed the planet... no. the planet is much to smart for that in the way it operates. The planet will kill off humans long before we ever get the chance to destroy the planet. the plaent basically rotaes on a reset process, it gets too hot or too cold and the cycle starts over (resets), and the whole cycle will process again.

so in conclusion. Yes, we are harming oursleves, and the planet of our lifetimes, but the scale and life span of the planet is so vast that we are a drop in the sea, the whole planet will grow back and thrive again and again in years to come.
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Old 06-06-2007, 10:52 PM   #15
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A votes yes, but i think it's an unfair question. Since the earth naturally warms and cools anyway, human CO2 is just another factor in the natural occurance (humas are apart of nature, despite our attempts to dominate it~) but I believe our industrializedness is speeding up the process and making it worse than it should be.

Whether or not it is our fault... it can't hurt to try and live a little more hippyish, try and break away from reliance on stuff that emits large amounts of carbon, and see what happens after that rather than completely reject the idea and continue burning our fossil fuels.

Lets all blame China for global warming, they're a coal nation.
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Old 06-06-2007, 11:13 PM   #16
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i prefer to trust a group of scientist than a group of money-driven selfish politicians that believe god created the earth in a week. even tho the industrialized countries cause the most damage, it's the poor countries that are already paying the consequences, with the extreme temperatures, crazy weather and ultimately all the **** that us, "the civilized" people, are producing
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Old 06-06-2007, 11:22 PM   #17
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you know its the money driven politicians promting global warming right? you knwo thats the whole point of the tax were all gonna have to pay. they want a bit more money. so all of a sudden they care about global warming. You just seemed like you were arguing the case for global warming as a negative thing and saying the politicians dont recognise it. there the ones pushing for it. Maybe not as obvious as it seems, i mean you haev all these campains tryoing to get them to do stuff abotu it. but i thin kit was thacher that got scientists to come up with figures so she could try and impose a tax on it ages ago or somthing
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Old 06-06-2007, 11:43 PM   #18
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George Bush is fervently against global warming because if he admits it it will cost billions for him to try and tackle.

The United Kingdom is putting measures in place to lower their emissions, that is why you are being taxed. It costs money to try and convert your power grid to something cleaner. it's not some great big conspiracy to try and make up for taxes lost from smokers....and when where these lost anyway? The smoking 'ban' is only in public places so lots of people will keep smoking - we've had the ban here in Ireland for quite some time now and it hasn't hugely reduced the number smoking.
The reason you tax smokers is because they drain the health service budget by being more likely to contract diseases so that's a whole other kettle of fish.

And as for this nonsense about the earth as a magic ball that will continue to live no matter what we do - yes it is true that the world goes in cycles of warm and cold. It is a fallacy to say that anything like this has ever happened before. The earth has no sensors that tell it when it's hot so it can cool down, it has to do with the o-zone layer, the distance from the sun, tides and a myriad other things - these are what go in cycle. We have turfed the earth out of synch, you can't just watch it recover this time.

On the subject of the earth as a CO2 producer - this is one of the logic defying stunts pulled off by the video linked at the top. (a video I might add that has been widely rubbished by scientists and the IPCC).
If you pay attention you'll notice that after the lovely man tells us that 70% of all CO2 emissions are from the sea he mumbles that it takes it back in again at night. Kind of like breathing. And, as half the world is always in the shade, the CO2 level actually remains the same in regards to how much the sea puts in or out.
Things like plants and trees actually store CO2 and save us from further emissions - there is an awful lot of CO2 stored neatly in the Amazon Rainforest, the only production there is coming from us cutting the tress down.

Last edited by mark.; 06-06-2007 at 11:47 PM. Reason: added extra
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Old 06-06-2007, 11:48 PM   #19
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i don't like politicians at all, i guess we have that common. but no matter how much money we end up paying in " green" taxes, it would be just a tiny fraction of the profit those huge coorporations that rule america--and probably many countries in europe too-- make by completely disregarding the mess they create. it's like farmaceuticals and governments investing billions of dollars to treat diseases that shouln't exist in the first place, instead of promoting a healthy lifestyle for most people, but that wouldn't be profitable, would it? wheather or not it's co2 that causes global warning, we all could be more responsable and treat our poor mother earth a little bit better. we're a plague, i feel particularly misanthropist today
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Old 06-06-2007, 11:51 PM   #20
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of course it will recover, the whole proccess of the ice caps melting and all that jazz when it gets hot causes a domino affect and cause after cause in the end reverts back round. you honestly thin that a few cars is going to destroy the planet?? http://mysite.verizon.net/mhieb/WVFo...ouse_data.html

Just how much of the "Greenhouse Effect" is caused by human activity?

It is about 0.28%, if water vapor is taken into account-- about 5.53%, if not.

Oh and if you bvelieve every penny of that tax on fags goes to the health service and every penny of tax from the green tax will go to producing cleaner energy your a bit of an idiot.

Human nature seems to be that we make bombs first and everything else comes second. in a real and metaphorical sence.

oh and on the plauge thing i completly agree, knida what i said in my post above though, were not a plauge that can really destroy the earth, humans are self destructibve. thoughout history i dont think theres any evidence to suggest otherwise. we like to blow each other up and we like to turn a blind eye to any great threat that may be imposed upon us.

If the planet doesnt make us exstint, we'll do it to oursleves.

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Old 06-06-2007, 11:59 PM   #21
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of course the earth will recover, the last thing mother earth need is us, but that's not the point. the point is the millions of people that havent' even heard the term 'greenhouse effect' are gonna pay the consequences for even the slightest changes in temperatures, and that's our fault as a consumerist and selfish society
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Old 06-07-2007, 01:13 AM   #22
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there is an economic interest for governments to support the theory that CO2 emmissions are the main cause of global warming. For example, it shifts the money away from the large oil industries and over to the agriculture industry which is trying to produce alternate fuels by burning our food supply (mostly corn). And corporations aren't a bad thing for the people of the United States to create jobs and cheap goods for the people; if government thinks they're such a problem (mainly left wing politicians at this point) then they should stop taxing smaller businesses so much; the taxes are so high that the large corporations are the only businesses that can stay alive.
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Old 06-07-2007, 01:17 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cali
i prefer to trust a group of scientist than a group of money-driven selfish politicians that believe god created the earth in a week.
lets leave God out of this, I happen to believe that God created the world, maybe in one week or maybe he created evolution. But either way don't mock my beliefs because you wouldn't like it if i did it to you and you'd probably call me an asshole. don't take cheap shots in debates its offensive and doesn't help you or anyone else
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Old 06-07-2007, 01:57 AM   #24
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cummon. thats not acheap shot. im sorry if it offends you ok. but we have as much right to say we think its completly stupid to believe "god" created the world in a week and that the universe is only a few thousand years old (is you believe in the god theory, then thats how old the universe is, according to the bible) as you do to call us all siners in your churchs. believe me i had to go to churchs for 14 years of my lidfe and still am forced to sit thorugh the odd mass here and there. makes me sick listening to those sheep.

If you were that comfortable in your belief then no man should be able to offend it.
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Old 06-07-2007, 01:58 AM   #25
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I voted Yes, way too much evidence pointing to humans as the cause. Everybody should check out a BBC showed called Horizon, they did and epi on "Global Dimming". That show changed the way I view Global Warming. Way too much info to put in a post but it's well worth the watch for everybody.

Cheers
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Old 06-07-2007, 01:59 AM   #26
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http://mysite.verizon.net/mhieb/WVFo...ouse_data.html
That obviously needs reposting.
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Old 06-07-2007, 03:28 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robmcgrail
If the planet doesnt make us extinct, we'll do it to oursleves.
Very well put, couldn't have said it better. This actually made me take a step back and consult with my own beliefs for a second. I've always thought of the earth as "Mother Earth" and imagined her as having very forgiving and likeable qualities (also knowing that her wrath can be deadly still). But what I never thought of was that no matter who or what you are, you can only be pushed so far. How long do you think our planet will put up with this attack before retaliating? Has it done so already? The one thing I really despise is whenever there's something new that concerns humanity there's always those politicians and wannabe know-it-alls who need to corrupt matters even more just so we're left apathetic in the end. Try explaining all the methods of calculus to any given person in one sitting and see if they don't drop the issue after a few minutes of disgust. This is what's happening to us and the way they see it...if you have an intelligent society, then you have an opposing society. The last thing the government wants is another attack, especially one by it's own people.

And one last thing. I believe the most sensible Global-Warming statement on this website was when Damien said the following in a recent interview:

"When I went to meet Laurie in her house in Los Angeles, I had this head full of questions, and I put them to her. I said, "What is your take on this, because I'm confused. I get information here and there. I want to believe, but I really don't know what to think." And she had a simple way of putting it that made me very comfortable with joining the march. She said that everyone she knows enjoys life, enjoys clean air. They like clean beaches, clean water, good food and a healthy lifestyle. And she said if we continue in the way that we're doing, we're going to destroy those beautiful things. But if we take the right steps and make an effort on a global level to change things, then we can preserve some of the beautiful things in life."



Quote:
Originally Posted by robmcgrail
If you were that comfortable in your belief then no man should be able to offend it.
Again, very very well put. Nothing against the person to whom this was offensive towards but he definitely has a point. However, one thing I've realized in these prior days is this: We all know how religous people (especially those of Christendom) believe about non-believers. We're often called sinners, heathens, pagans, satanists, evolutionists, anarchists, etc. And at the end of the day, the hate is all too real. But when you look at the other end of the spectrum, you see that many of the non-believers return this hate towards their religious counterparts by expressing similar names such as jesus-freaks, sheep, old school, murderers, criminals, scam artists and con-men, etc. (the term murderer doesn't refer to every religious person, it is only a reference to those who were involved with the crusades). But what we must realize is this...Are the non-believers any better than the believers when they choose to participate in this senseless name-calling and by returning the same exact hatred? Aren't we infact lowering ourselves to their level? I find that I am no better than my Christian neighbor when I tell others about my feelings toward him than when he tells others his feelings about me. And rather than destroying this hate that breeds among us, we are only providing fuel for the fire that will eventually destroy us. The extremists in any particular metaphysical affiliation are the ones that ruin it for everyone so let them pray for our souls or whatever, but let's not waste our time with theirs.

Last edited by Valentino; 06-07-2007 at 03:43 AM.
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Old 06-07-2007, 04:31 AM   #28
Five Leaves Left
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i was more offended that the statement seemed to say that they would rather listen to an (implied) atheistic scientist than a god believing politician. politicians should never be trusted on scientific issues but there are scientist that believe in the theistic creation theory rather than the atheistic evolution theory also, not all people that believe God created the world dismiss the idea of an old earth or evolution; to do that would be foolish because it hurt christianity in the late 17th century (or around then) when other scientific debates arose and christians took the side of what the Bible appeared to say about the shape of the earth and whether or not the earth revolved around the sun. People need to realize that a lot of these parts of the Bible are figures of speech. Also many Christians make a good argument for the earth being old and evolution through the involvement of God. So what I meant to say (i'm sure what i said sounded harsher cause i was kinda pissed) was that theistic scientists shouldn't be dismissed as invalid sources and just because someone does not believe that global warming is caused by people being irresponsible doesn't mean that they are just listening to christian men in suits that refer to themselves as republicans (this is not to say that all or even most republicans are like this). Infact much of the opposition to the human responsibility theory comes from atheistic scientists and many christians support the theory that we are the cause of global warming (good luck getting them to vote against the republican party tho, most of them think that God is a republican)
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Old 06-07-2007, 05:41 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Five Leaves Left
...many christians support the theory that we are the cause of global warming.


I'm sorry Five Leaves Left, I just wanted to quote you on saying the above statement cuz it's pretty funny. But nothing personal, I know you just meant "we" as in "people of the world." Wouldn't that be interesting though:

"Sorry for interrupting your viewing of the Damien Rice Live Stream but we've just come across some ground-breaking news. According to major US government funding and research, Buddhists are the sole reason for the effects of Global Warming!!! The president has issued an Orange Level crisis warning and you must abandon, destroy or set aflame all yoga mats and laughing buddha figurines. Here's Tom the Muslim with the weather..."
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Old 06-07-2007, 05:55 AM   #30
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no, no. we all know that Christians aren't the cause of any problems in the world; Christians are perfect, its the Muslims we (the people of the world) need to worry about
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