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Old 02-11-2011, 09:33 PM   #1
Glockypaws
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Default To Damien and His fans: RE - New Album [Very long... don't read if you don't wanna]

Okay, so I've been surfing around youtube and reading some of the posts here so I thought I'd post about my own opinion and give y'all a few of my cents (I don't have many to spare, so you can each only have two! )

I don't know if Damien ever sees the things posted here, but if he does I hope that I am not off-base here and/or have not insulted or been offensive to anything.

[This is long, and might make little sense as I am tired and have been working on some production stuff all day.

Skip all the way to the bottom paragraphs to get /right straight dead on/ to the point.

Also, feel free to click back... this is mostly just a very long rant that I need to get out of my brain. Though I do hope to help some people understand a bit more about "why the album is taking so long". If you care to, I would love to be humored." ]


I have only a very tiny glimpse of what being a musician is like, I am basically a baby to this scene and have only been (although furiously and obsessively) practicing, studying, performing, and recording my stuff for about a year now. Iis safe to say I know little to nothing about the big pictures of "musician" or "songwriter" apart from what little I've learned through auto-didactic experience... and it may very well stay this way forever. I don't mind if it does. It keeps life fun and offers the possibility of infinite learning, which I feel is key to creative satisfaction.

"It's not hard to grow when you know that you just don't know"

When Damien released O, he has said he felt it was a very "selfish" record, that he only wanted to make it so that he could say he did it and he may not have made another one after he got that out of his system. I feel that he refers to the same thing as I did earlier about truly needing to get those emotions and feelings out of you as songs. This is, in my opinion, the difference between a /musician/ and a guitar player, or a singer, or even so much as a "band". It's the inexplicable /need/ to express yourself through the near-ethereal beauty that is music as opposed to the /desire/ to "be in a band", "get famous", "be rich", etc.

After O was released and the tour was coming to a close... Damien was under a great deal of pressure [I do not know all of this for sure, I am just speculating from what I've heard and read from interviews and such] to release "the second album" that he at one point was unsure if he would ever even do. He was rising in the spotlight and the pressure from the band, his fans, and of course, the record companies.

He has started that he was so rushed to release 9 that he put a number of songs on it that he wouldn't otherwise have released. Don't get me wrong, I love 9 and every song on it... but a creative mind being /forced/ to release (en masse, mind you) a number of works that they themselves are dissatisfied with is almost guaranteed to cause a good deal of anxiety. Think of a world class painter being forced to have his discarded rough sketches hung in a museum.

Even the most brilliant of creative minds (damien amongst them, in my book) are most likely in constant turmoil with their own abilities. I by no means claim to be any sort of awe-inspiring or even /good/ songwriter, but I know that I am my worst critic and the first one to say that something sucks or to have judgements on things that a lot of people don't even notice.

So, what I'm getting at... is that the more damien's fans [albeit him having many] constantly question the album's release date, beg, push, get frustrated and "give up" on Damien... the more likely he is to take longer to actually put something out, simply cause he has more to think about. I would love to see another album from my favorite musician as much as anybody, but at the same time I would not want it to be anything but the best that the artist feels he is capable of producing.

If Damien is the type where criticism doesn't bother him anymore (which, with how popular he is I'm sure he has to be) then throwing in opinions about the side-projects and other musical things he has done lately be them good or bad wouldn't effect this... and may perhaps change the direction of the music to come. However, I feel that the best way to get a new album, and even better, a /great/ new album, is to simply be patient and not constantly ask when it'll be here. It's a choice between speed and quality, and I choose quality by a long mile.

Damien is much older and more experienced than I, and I am sure he is not hard pressed for cash. Thusly, he has /no/ reason to rush and try to put something together just to satisfy a rent payment or to buy dinner at night. Moreover, one of the only reasons he /would/ have to rush would be the incessant pleas of his fans for a new album. I'm not talking about the eskimos here in particular... youtube search for any of his videos and you'll find that almost every Damo vid has at least one "RAWR I CAN HAS WANT NEW ALBUM NOWWW!" comment on it. This has bothered me enough that I felt like making this post... if it was annoying or gratuitous, I apologize in advance.

-whew- ... So... in all honesty the point of that whole superfluously long rant was nothing more than to say "Be quiet and wait and when the new album comes it'll be a lot more amazing than it may have been if the artist were constantly questioning himself due to fans getting pissed off at him."

And to encourage others to do the same.


So as they push and beg for grace
Ignore unknowing and hold your place
Let melody flow straight from your heart
That's where it began, so fly back to the start
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Last edited by Glockypaws; 02-12-2011 at 04:34 AM. Reason: Corrections.
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Old 02-12-2011, 12:09 AM   #2
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I don't want to be harsh and I cant be nice.So I will skip what I have to say about this post.Anyway how old are you? Just asking...
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Old 02-12-2011, 01:04 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glockypaws View Post

When Damien released O, he has said he felt it was a very "selfish" record, that he only wanted to make it so that he could say he did it and he may not have made another one after he got that out of his system. I feel that he refers to the same thing as I did earlier about truly needing to get those emotions and feelings out of you as songs. This is, in my opinion, the difference between a /musician/ and a guitar player, or a singer, or even so much as a "band". It's the inexplicable /need/ to express yourself through the near-ethereal beauty that is music as opposed to the /desire/ to "be in a band", "get famous", "be rich", etc.

After O was released and the tour was coming to a close... Damien was under a great deal of pressure [I do not know all of this for sure, I am just speculating from what I've heard and read from interviews and such] to release "the second album" that he at one point was unsure if he would ever even do. He was rising in the spotlight and the pressure from the band, his fans, and of course, the record companies.

He has started that he was so rushed to release 9 that he put a number of songs on it that he wouldn't otherwise have released. Don't get me wrong, I love 9 and every song on it... but a creative mind being /forced/ to release (en masse, mind you) a number of works that they themselves are dissatisfied with is almost guaranteed to cause a good deal of anxiety. Think of a world class painter being forced to have his discarded rough sketches hung in a museum.

Even the most brilliant of creative minds (damien amongst them, in my book) are most likely in constant turmoil with their own abilities. I by no means claim to be any sort of awe-inspiring or even /good/ songwriter, but I know that I am my worst critic and the first one to say that something sucks or to have judgements on things that a lot of people don't even notice.

So, what I'm getting at... is that the more damien's fans (especially his biggest ones, like some of the folk here on this site) constantly question the album's release date, beg, push, get frustrated and "give up" on Damien... the more likely he is to take longer to actually put something out.. if at all. I would love to see another album from my favorite musician as much as anybody, but at the same time I would not want it to be anything but the best that the artist feels he is capable of producing.

If Damien is like me in the regards that the criticism doesn't bother him anymore (which, with how popular he is I'm sure he has to be) then throwing in opinions about the side-projects and other musical things he has done lately be them good or bad wouldn't effect this... and may perhaps change the direction of the music to come. However, I feel that the best way to get a new album, and even better, a /great/ new album, is to simply be patient and not constantly ask when it'll be here. It's a choice between speed and quality, and I choose quality by a long mile.

I'm struggling with my own music because I am an unemployed (so I may dedicate myself fully to my work and school), very poor, and very anal about the songs I put out, college student. I've been working for a long while on my first album and I am feeling the pressure of getting it finished so that I can start selling it. I don't make music for the money, I make it for the love of music... but things like eating and having an apartment are nice. It is an unfortunate place to be... trying to find a perfect balance between getting it finished and marketing it as soon as I can... and not compromising any of my vision for the music as an art.
[/i]
^^^^ the shorter story!
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Old 02-12-2011, 01:13 AM   #4
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You must not read too much of the forum lately, because you would see that most of his biggest fans understand why he hasn't released anything yet. The ones that get seriously whiny and mopey and give up on Damien generally don't hang around for very long. Sure it would be great to have some new Damien news, or songs, a new album, but a lot of us come here because we've made great friends with like minded individuals with great taste in music, movies, and life in general. Man, I thought I could ramble on....
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Old 02-12-2011, 01:20 AM   #5
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"Moreover, one of the only reasons he /would/ have to rush would be the incessant pleas of his fans for a new album."

Right on, Damo: RUSH is the best rock band in the universe! I'm a massive fan of both of you who's incessantly pleading for their new album ("Clockwork Angels") too!
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Old 02-12-2011, 04:50 AM   #6
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I apologize for some of the foolish things I had said in my post. It is a concept that had been brewing in my head for a good long while and the more I see it on each and every comments section for youtube videos, live performances, his side-projects the more is started to annoy me.

I scaled down my post to rid it of a good bit of extraneous data and other stuff that wasn't relevant to the point I was trying to make.. and I sincerely hope nobody believes that I was speaking of or even thinking of anybody on here. It's just one of those on the backburner thoughts that got turned to high... and then everything in my mind on the subject proceeded to flow.

So, again I apologize for my ignorance. And to rachlanee, I kind of noticed that... though my awkwardness socially makes me see such tight knit communities as a bit cliquey and I don't know where to begin! I'll try and be less edgy and just post around on things more casually, hopefully that'll help :>


To the first poster: I'm sorry I frustrated you, I see where you're coming from in a way. But to answer your question I'm 21. So yes, a foolish youngin, but one that tries hard!

The main topic has been modified and I think it still conveys what I was trying to get across. Though if this has potential to upset people... I would not be offended if a mod were to nix the entire thread.

Thanks Eskimos <3
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Old 02-12-2011, 05:08 AM   #7
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^^^Don't think so much about it. And it's not that cliquish here. I wouldn't be on the internet so much if I wasn't so socially awkward myself. Good luck with your music.
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Old 02-12-2011, 08:39 AM   #8
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You could write a book Damien Rice for dummies. I'm sorry if I sound unpleasant,but as Damien I'm a lot older than you. I have all the right to be.I'm not upset,but you are here writing this long post trying to teach a mother of 3 how to change diapers and I can tell you a mother of 3 would tell you to **** off.We all know he doesn't like pressure,but that's what we do because that's what fans does. Just imagine yourself h*orny as hell in a first meeting with that gorgeous girl/boy you've dreaming about and she/he wears a funny t-shirt saying " I don't have sex on a first date". That could be a joke or she/he could be serious.If I were you I wouldn't stop trying to have sex with her/him the whole night or at least try to find out if she really mean to not have sex on our first date or that t-shirt could be just to tease you. Naughty girl/boy huh??
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Old 02-12-2011, 10:01 AM   #9
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We all know he doesn't like pressure,but that's what we do because that's what fans does.
no. please don't generalize...
there is the "loud" fan that writes on here things like "he will never release anything good again, i give up on him", or that meets damien in a bar and asks him about a new album, or posts on youtube thousands of "i want a new album!" comments...
and then there's the "quiet" fan that waits in silence, hoping for a new release without necessarily giving up on him after 2 years of waiting or something...

so, please don't generalize with things like "that's what fans do"... because we all have different ways of being fans. i myself don't think he should release something if he's not satisfied with it in the first place... i didn't like 9 as much as i liked O, and in the 'famous' hotpress interview i kind of understood why... and this doesn't happen to damien alone, i think, because how many artists and bands fail the second album? too many. it is probably the pression around them that pushes them to release something they're not 100% sure of or satisfied with...

so, yes, i hope damien releases something in the future, but there's no need to push him and ask him and beg him, and no need to get upset if he takes time to release a new album...

then, Amie, why are you getting upset? I think Glockypaws was just explaining his ways of being a fan... he's not teaching you how to change diapers, he's just saying how he changes them, then you can keep doing whatever you want if you don't like his way...
the main reason i liked this forum in the first place was that you can actually "talk" here, and that's something you couldn't do, for example, on the old dr.com community... but if we start commenting to threads with posts like "i don't want to be harsh and don't want to get upset, so i won't answer" then we may become one of those close-minded fanbases that make new members run away...

and regarding your post, Glockypaws, I appreciate you got the time to write this here, but not many members on here rush damien or anything... I've read the comments on youtube too, but then, on youtube you'll also find comments like "james blunt is the best singer-songwriter ever!!!" and "alexandra burke is way better than jeff buckley!" so i don't think it's a reliable source...
I enjoyed reading your post, anyway
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Old 02-12-2011, 11:58 AM   #10
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Glo32 I dont think you got what I was trying to say. I'm probably the last of his fans that is pushing him or saying that I want a new album. I've been to Iceland and saw 3 of the 4 record sessions,I've been to Giske,I'm happy with the last few songs released and I'm very satisfied with what he IS doing or NOT doing.I've talked to him after concerts and I never asked him about a new album and what are his plans for the next 5 years and you know why? Because when I think about Damien Rice I see more than an album and more than a musician. If you read carefully some of my old posts I've been defending his right and wish to take time and for me it doesn't really matter how long it takes because I'm fan of other artists that are releasing new things and touring and I'm always getting to know new artists,so it is not like I'm waiting for Damien. My point was exactly the same as yours "there are many different type of fans". I respect people that would be asking him and pushing him and I respect the ones that wait. The only kind of fan I don't respect and don't like are the ones calling the guy names because he is not releasing a new album like I read here before.I'm not close minded at all,but a long post to "explain" something that everybody knows I see as unnecessary. So I can tell you for sure you totally misunderstood what I was trying to say and you're the one that sounds pissed.People can talk here. He said what he wanted I'm saying what I want and you say whatever you want. I think people should just stop trying to understand why he is not releasing a new album or make conclusions from things he said before or put the blame on fans that pushes him.It is not that simple. There,right there I get pissed.
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Old 02-12-2011, 02:46 PM   #11
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hoping for a new release without necessarily giving up on him after 2 years of waiting

Would that it were only 2 years! 4 years between O and 9, and now working on 5 years before the next one....

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Old 02-12-2011, 04:59 PM   #12
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lol I like this debate, I'm gonna throw in my 2cents at the risk of sounding like an idiot, not that anybody cares or gives 2 ****s but here it goes: I've not been a Damien fan since he started out, but until recently, regardless, I hold that it's not the quantity of fan years but the quality of appreciation that makes the fan... and only recently I've come to appreciate Damien In the way of his artistic persona; his perspective and views on life are something that i agree with and admire. I like how he can come out and be totally honest about his life and his emotions and discuss them publicly to his fans... coz you guys or myself included are really fortunate he does this. I've been an Iron & Wine fan since Sam Beam put out his first album, but he never has sat down and discussed the meaning of a song or talked about his life for that matter, as a fan I regret that but it sort of helps to Idealize his music more; I&W just released an album after almost 4 years of queue, and it's not what I expected it's totally different sound and It's gonna take some time getting used to. and with these sort of artists that are not mainstream and are not in it for the money, inspiration comes really hard for them. they actually want to put out something of themselves that they're proud of and that is sincere. I write Spanish poetry and it's true that you are your worst critic when you actually feel passionate of your own art, I'm a fairly good guitar player also, but I've never, for the life of me, been inspired to write a song. and maybe I never will, it's just not in me I guess, and I could maybe try and come up with some half ass song hoping it will make me famous but that's not really my priority, Whatever I do i want it to be a little of me and that it says something about me that I can really be proud of, in that way I guess I can relate to the way Damien approaches his art. so that's my take if it makes any sense. If you're True with your art it takes a long time to come up with something you're proud of, and that explains why honest artists take so long to put something out, whether it be a record, a poetry book, a painting or something. It's not all free association writing all the time, and when they do put something out, it doesn't really matter to them how people feel about it, it's just out there, take it or leave it, like it or hate it; in the end you know you've given the best in you.
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Old 02-12-2011, 09:08 PM   #13
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lol I like this debate, I'm gonna throw in my 2cents at the risk of sounding like an idiot, not that anybody cares or gives 2 ****s but here it goes: I've not been a Damien fan since he started out, but until recently, regardless, I hold that it's not the quantity of fan years but the quality of appreciation that makes the fan... and only recently I've come to appreciate Damien In the way of his artistic persona; his perspective and views on life are something that i agree with and admire. I like how he can come out and be totally honest about his life and his emotions and discuss them publicly to his fans... coz you guys or myself included are really fortunate he does this. I've been an Iron & Wine fan since Sam Beam put out his first album, but he never has sat down and discussed the meaning of a song or talked about his life for that matter, as a fan I regret that but it sort of helps to Idealize his music more; I&W just released an album after almost 4 years of queue, and it's not what I expected it's totally different sound and It's gonna take some time getting used to. and with these sort of artists that are not mainstream and are not in it for the money, inspiration comes really hard for them. they actually want to put out something of themselves that they're proud of and that is sincere. I write Spanish poetry and it's true that you are your worst critic when you actually feel passionate of your own art, I'm a fairly good guitar player also, but I've never, for the life of me, been inspired to write a song. and maybe I never will, it's just not in me I guess, and I could maybe try and come up with some half ass song hoping it will make me famous but that's not really my priority, Whatever I do i want it to be a little of me and that it says something about me that I can really be proud of, in that way I guess I can relate to the way Damien approaches his art. so that's my take if it makes any sense. If you're True with your art it takes a long time to come up with something you're proud of, and that explains why honest artists take so long to put something out, whether it be a record, a poetry book, a painting or something. It's not all free association writing all the time, and when they do put something out, it doesn't really matter to them how people feel about it, it's just out there, take it or leave it, like it or hate it; in the end you know you've given the best in you.
I agree with you. I have said that before myself,but we have to knowledge that people are different and people has expectations,so I apologize to the person who started the thread if I sounded harsh because what I was trying to say is that people deals differently with their expectations and it doesn't make of these people a bad fan or a better fan the worse or the better they deal with the waiting and I believe Damien is used to both in a way that he won't decide to give out or hold back his work because of what people want. So let's let people be free to put their frustrations out there and not tell them what to do or how to behave as long as they can respect the artist and not come here calling him lazy for example.I hope he will give something out sometime,but honestly he could quite his career tomorrow and I would remain a huge fan of his work and personality.
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Old 02-13-2011, 07:17 PM   #14
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no. please don't generalize...
there is the "loud" fan that writes on here things like "he will never release anything good again, i give up on him", or that meets damien in a bar and asks him about a new album, or posts on youtube thousands of "i want a new album!" comments...
and then there's the "quiet" fan that waits in silence, hoping for a new release without necessarily giving up on him after 2 years of waiting or something...

so, please don't generalize with things like "that's what fans do"... because we all have different ways of being fans. i myself don't think he should release something if he's not satisfied with it in the first place... i didn't like 9 as much as i liked O, and in the 'famous' hotpress interview i kind of understood why... and this doesn't happen to damien alone, i think, because how many artists and bands fail the second album? too many. it is probably the pression around them that pushes them to release something they're not 100% sure of or satisfied with...

so, yes, i hope damien releases something in the future, but there's no need to push him and ask him and beg him, and no need to get upset if he takes time to release a new album...

then, Amie, why are you getting upset? I think Glockypaws was just explaining his ways of being a fan... he's not teaching you how to change diapers, he's just saying how he changes them, then you can keep doing whatever you want if you don't like his way...
the main reason i liked this forum in the first place was that you can actually "talk" here, and that's something you couldn't do, for example, on the old dr.com community... but if we start commenting to threads with posts like "i don't want to be harsh and don't want to get upset, so i won't answer" then we may become one of those close-minded fanbases that make new members run away...

and regarding your post, Glockypaws, I appreciate you got the time to write this here, but not many members on here rush damien or anything... I've read the comments on youtube too, but then, on youtube you'll also find comments like "james blunt is the best singer-songwriter ever!!!" and "alexandra burke is way better than jeff buckley!" so i don't think it's a reliable source...
I enjoyed reading your post, anyway

i really agree with you, glo... and since i´m utterly tired, both physically and mentally, and my english isn´t that good sometimes, i´ll take your words (if you don´t mind ).

glock (hey, glo and glocks... ok, silly, blame to the tiredness ). i read your post on friday, after midnight (was very tired too)... and i remember i thought i like it (and i read it all). but, as glo said there are fans (i don´t like this word, he) that are waiting, patienly, for damien to give to the world another piece of his best... and for those who feel they gave up... well, i think they have the right (don´t they) and that they were also genuine when they said they love damien and his music and the way he expresses himself and bla bla bla, but they don´t feel the same way anymore. but this is just my humble opinion, he.

anyway... i´m glad you have taken your time and you have found a way to share all your thoughts and feelings regarding this matter.
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Old 02-13-2011, 07:30 PM   #15
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lDamien In the way of his artistic persona; his perspective and views on life are something that i agree with and admire. I like how he can come out and be totally honest about his life and his emotions and discuss them publicly to his fans... coz you guys or myself included are really fortunate he does this.

well, here another thing i gree with... and i know that damien doesn´t speak for us to hear him as a preacher or a saviour or a guru, lol. he just expresses himself and i do believe he is one of the best (including people that i know and i don´t in real life) at this.
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Old 02-13-2011, 09:56 PM   #16
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Glo32 I dont think you got what I was trying to say. I'm probably the last of his fans that is pushing him or saying that I want a new album. I've been to Iceland and saw 3 of the 4 record sessions,I've been to Giske,I'm happy with the last few songs released and I'm very satisfied with what he IS doing or NOT doing.I've talked to him after concerts and I never asked him about a new album and what are his plans for the next 5 years and you know why? Because when I think about Damien Rice I see more than an album and more than a musician. If you read carefully some of my old posts I've been defending his right and wish to take time and for me it doesn't really matter how long it takes because I'm fan of other artists that are releasing new things and touring and I'm always getting to know new artists,so it is not like I'm waiting for Damien. My point was exactly the same as yours "there are many different type of fans". I respect people that would be asking him and pushing him and I respect the ones that wait. The only kind of fan I don't respect and don't like are the ones calling the guy names because he is not releasing a new album like I read here before.I'm not close minded at all,but a long post to "explain" something that everybody knows I see as unnecessary. So I can tell you for sure you totally misunderstood what I was trying to say and you're the one that sounds pissed.
I think we are getting each other wrong
I wasn't say you are the "bad" kind of fan or anything... I was just saying that you seemed a bit pissed off in your first comment (the "i don't want to be harsh so i won't reply" thing) and especially on the "you're teaching me how to change diapers" comment, where it almost seems you were taking it on a personal level...
I've read your posts on this forum, anyway, and I totally respect you as a fan, so please don't take it personal as I have nothing against you or against the things you do or say as a fan...

Quote:
People can talk here. He said what he wanted I'm saying what I want and you say whatever you want.
And I like that, but if everyone here welcomes a new thread like this posting things like "I don't want to be harsh so it's better if I don't reply", then nobody replies, the thread dies, and we make the person that started the thread feel stupid... that's how we risk to become a closed fanbase, I think (I wasn't saying you are close-minded at all)
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Old 02-14-2011, 01:24 PM   #17
borneoman
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I got the funniest message last week from someone saying something like 'Damien hasn't released the album this winter cos it's too cold to go on tour during winter, sure he's waiting for the warmer summer months to release it and tour' that's a positive thinking person!!!
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Old 02-14-2011, 03:53 PM   #18
rachlanee
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Originally Posted by borneoman View Post
I got the funniest message last week from someone saying something like 'Damien hasn't released the album this winter cos it's too cold to go on tour during winter, sure he's waiting for the warmer summer months to release it and tour' that's a positive thinking person!!!
^^^^haha. so he's hybernating?
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Old 02-15-2011, 07:02 AM   #19
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yes, sure the new album will be out later in the sunny days!!!!!!
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