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05-08-2012, 04:16 AM | #301 | |
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Damien wrote all those songs all by himself and gave them the parts to play accompanying him? Or did he wrote a chord progression and they each added to the song? Because that's how bands work. |
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05-08-2012, 04:49 AM | #302 | ||||
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It's a way to expand your audience because someone who likes Dave Matthews will listen to the album to hear Dave Matthews, and discover a new artist. Quote:
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I'll listen to it but I'm not expecting much. He's chased away Tomo who's drumming is what I first loved about this music all the way back in the fall of 2002 when I first listened to it. And while live shows are better without Lisa, albums are not. He hasn't played with a band in over five years so I have no idea who would even play the other instruments on an album or a tour. Quote:
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05-08-2012, 04:52 AM | #303 | ||
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Also, that track has piano on it. Wonder who's playing that? Someone from BellX1? Because the Juniper recording of Volcano is actually more piano than guitar. Thanks for proving my point because I totally forgot about that recording. Last edited by mario_d; 05-08-2012 at 04:58 AM. |
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05-08-2012, 04:59 AM | #304 |
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05-08-2012, 06:16 AM | #305 | |||
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Woman Like a Man was released (live versions, still released commercially). Although the others that you mention weren't released, they've certainly been performed a lot and the songwriters would have been owed royalties for that as well. I also noticed that the following songs were recorded with Juniper: Amie, I Remember, Eskimo, Me My Yoke + I, Cross-Eyed Bear. Were these credited appropriately? |
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05-08-2012, 09:13 AM | #306 | |
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I highly doubt that. So this is just one perfect example for how your "facts" have hardly any value in this discussion, because they can be interpreted in different ways. So just stop accusing us of putting him on a pedestal and therefore not seeing his faults, when it's actually you who lets your (negative) perception of Damien's persona influence how you interpret his behavior. You really come across as a 10year old who's been bitter about Damien ever since he refused oh so direspectfully to sign a piece of paper for you.
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05-08-2012, 11:35 AM | #307 |
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Ooh come on mario, T-Lloyd didn't personally attack you it's called giving advice based on personal experience. don't go all: I DESERVE RESPECT when you knowingly go against EVERYONE'S opinion. frankly i might actually just take the advice. Because the only thing i am doing is explaining the 2nd side of all the stories you probably already know.
He fired lisa in an unprofessional and disrespectful way. And i should stop excusing it for something else? No. It WAS everything you said it was except the fact that once again they were in a relationship... You really think ANYTHING between those 2 was professional? Relations between damien and the rest of the band were friendships/professional relationships... the relationship between lisa and damien was personal... and if you look at it that way, AGAIN i would've made the same call as damien did. You can keep just going "it was unprofessional" but it wasn't even professional in the first place now please stop about this because you already know this and im just the one who keeps reading you dumb ass fact you already know. He shouldn't have quit Juniper because there was a contract? and he should've just went along with the oppression of the producers. Well this is just bull****.... Have you ever been in a band were it just didn't work out? what do you do then. YOU LEAVE. Even if there is a ****ing contract. He clearly didn't know that the producers asked to change so much before signing it. once again don't ignore these facts. He signed it, THEN he didn't like the commercial direction anymore. while the other band members did. fine then you leave! that's the most human thing to do! They disagreed he shouldn't have played ball because then he would write stuff he didn't feel is true. He didn't credit bellx1? After looking around it's quite clear he wrote the songs... so why credit them? I just remembered the Volcano '97 demo. isn't that enough proof HE wrote it? Please never ask me to "look at your fact" again, if you're just going to act like you don't know mine. |
05-08-2012, 02:31 PM | #308 | |||
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Again, I don't know what songs you're talking about. Quote:
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Songwriters only get a cut of album sales. The WLaM single did not generate a meaningful amount of revenue. Volcano is the only Damien recording that generated revenue. Damien continues to get paid, as he should from the BellX1 sales of albums with Tongue, Volcano and I think one other tune. There's a lot of stuff there, its pretty messy. But here's what we know. Damien registered songs in his name alone. BellX1 registered as their names and Damien, and released a few on albums. Damien didn't sue to get 100% of the royalties for songwriter on those tunes even though he's claimed to be sole songwriter. |
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05-08-2012, 02:42 PM | #309 | ||
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Last edited by mario_d; 05-08-2012 at 02:51 PM. |
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05-08-2012, 02:50 PM | #310 | |||
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These are the rules Wheels reiterated:
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Poor Damien didn't like being told what to do? Welcome to the real world. He entered a contract to make music and perform with the band Juniper, then he bailed on them because he didn't like what they are doing. That is not acceptable behavior. Again, imagine doing that at your own job. Agree to build someone a webpage, then quit because they want you to use the color scheme they selected. Quote:
I don't know what you think "writing a song" means, but its more than just lyrics and chord progressions. He performed the song with Juniper and it continued to grow and fill out. Unless he told all of them exactly how to play their instruments, they had input on the development of the song. Also, you don't acknowledge that there's a keyboard on that demo in addition to the guitar. |
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05-08-2012, 03:15 PM | #311 | ||
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The again nobody really insulted you did they now? There is a fine line between projecting your opinion on someone and actually insulting someone.
By the looks of it. This is actually freedom of speech Do your homework please. Quote:
No you won't always get what you want in a band but the commercialisation of artists is a VERY well know issue a lot of recording artist currently have with the industry the last couple of decades. Damien didn't agree with this so he left. So to get it straight: If you were to be forced into creating songs a way you don't feel is right, you're not comfortable in and does not work for you.... you would just keep going? Or put it even more simple: If you were to sign for a job but it turned out to be something you HATE doing. would you continue? Ofcourse he didn't know what he was getting into. please read back the interviews about juniper. Quote:
If you make a remix with the original artist of a popular song is the artist who first wrote the song supposed to credit you too? |
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05-08-2012, 03:44 PM | #312 | |
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I could care less how many shows you have seen - does that make you a better fan or give you this sense of obligation you so long for?? my question though was not how many have you seen but if he came TODAY would you go see him within reasonable distance? |
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05-08-2012, 04:42 PM | #313 | ||
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I noticed that the work ID numbers between each version of the songs are close to each other. This doesn't prove anything, but with other artists I've seen that songs registered at the same time have numbers that are near each other -- it could be an indicator that both parties discussed it and registered each of the songs at the same time. Or it could be 4 huge coincidences. VOLCANO (Damien Rice: 520294559 / BellX1: 520294577) TONGUE (Damien Rice: 501522678 / BellX1: 501522696) FACE (Damien Rice: 360803712 / BellX1 360803730) WOMAN LIKE A MAN (Damien Rice: 530967812 / BellX1: 530967830) Tongue is registered without crediting Damien here: http://repertoire.bmi.com/title.asp?...erytype=WorkID What a ****ty thing to do, right? Nope, still don't know enough about the situation. Last edited by faninor; 05-08-2012 at 04:45 PM. |
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05-08-2012, 04:45 PM | #314 |
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Those numbers - phone numbers, right?
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Yeah Last edited by cille; 05-08-2012 at 04:47 PM. |
05-08-2012, 05:02 PM | #315 |
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Wow. I'll take that back. 5-year-old seems far more appropriate in hindsight.
I'm done here. Have a happy rest of your life, Mario. You should get out and play in the sun more often.
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05-08-2012, 05:52 PM | #316 | |
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Wheels, second personal attack from the same person. Destroying the friendliness of the community. |
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05-08-2012, 05:53 PM | #317 | |
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And those numbers in ASCAP are sequential. It means Damien filed those songs alone, and BellX1 followed behind crediting everyone. |
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05-08-2012, 07:33 PM | #318 | |
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like Sting said if you hate somebody, set them free!!!!! well maybe it was not that
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05-08-2012, 09:39 PM | #319 |
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It's a fallacy to think that ASCAP would process and assigns work IDs in precisely the order that they were submitted. But ignoring that, your reasoning is not very good. Damien registered the song, BellX1 found out and reacted by registered their own version, and all of this happened within such a short timeframe that the unique Work IDs assigned by a worldwide organization were that close to each other. I think it's pretty clear that they were communicating with each other first and you act like you know just how that conversation must have gone. There's just not enough information to continue a worthwhile discussion about it. Maybe I'll chime back in when there's something new to discuss. Hopefully it won't be too long.
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05-08-2012, 09:40 PM | #320 | |
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it is to the point of being incredibly sad................. |
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05-08-2012, 11:55 PM | #321 |
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damien owes nothing
Damien wrote:
Volcano Woman like a Man 100% I dont care who credits who...he would never sing them/record them if he didnt he also wrote or mostly wrote : Face Tongue he would never play them live if he didnt, he has plenty of better material to sing live and would never 'cover' them live if he didnt contribute most/all otherwise I also believe he wrote part of (or all of) "never" (renamed/changed 'eve apple of my eye' ) ..as the chords are identicla to Cold water, eskimo, lonely soldier/sleep dont weep and others...plus he does vocals on the studio recordings...I believe he was a major contributer to Bell X1's BIGGEST HIt ever Damien wrote 80% of everything Juniper did so stop with Damien "owes' royalties as he DOES'NT!!! although I like what Bell X1 did on 'Flock', he is why they had the success they did with 'music in mouth' and "Neither am i "..I believe he even wrote 'little sister' and others from M.I.M , though not a great song....Damien was Juniper!! and him leaving was a big loss to the bands future |
05-09-2012, 01:24 AM | #322 | |
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A number of posters here have purely fabricated that I hate damien rice. Just because he's an asshole doesn't mean I give a flying **** about him. It's just sad to watch people worship an asshole. And defend an asshole. Just like a battered woman. |
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05-09-2012, 02:10 AM | #323 |
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which was the gist of my question you still haven't answered.................would you still go see someone you deem an arsehole?
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05-09-2012, 06:19 AM | #324 |
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Mario, being very honest, I think you went too far, you're out of control. It's clear from your posts that you have this anger/hate/grudge against Damien to the point of no longer being rational/objective... it's like all this hate is clouding your judgment and poisoning your thoughts... I really think this thread should die cos it's actually reason with someone who's only discussing out of pure hate and anger. You sound like one of them people making up theories about UFOs or 9/11. What next? Maybe Damo isn't really Irish, he's just from London but he made it up cos it's more cool. Same with Lisa. She's from South Africa but she just pretends to be Irish.
Also reading your old posts, I think you've crossed the line. You've gone too far into insulting Damien at a personal level. For instance, judging Damien cos of his charity is going too far. That shouldn't be tolerated imho.
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05-09-2012, 06:51 AM | #325 | |
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It's not sad to watch people defend someone whose music they love and who they respect as an artist (not a commercial music making machine who owes us something). It's sad to watch someone who has clearly lost it and cannot get a grip on reality, stubborn is not the word. Admit defeat, no one is on the same page as you. (Another personal attack Wheels, best block me) |
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05-09-2012, 07:57 AM | #326 |
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I think Vienna and Borneoman said it best.
I am done with this argument now... I should have taken T-Lloyd's advice when he first gave it. Since I started reading the forum it was always such a lovely and friendly place and I've been reading for something like 2 years now. It sucks that it changed so much on the opinion of 1 troubled person. I also feel sorry that I even contributed to this as much as I did. Let's just continue the way it was and hopefully leave all of this behind. And all the people who truly think Damien is such an asshole please just get off the Damien rice fan page then |
05-09-2012, 02:18 PM | #327 |
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I will continue the pile on...................and i actually defended you in the beginning for speaking your mind
but unfortunately it seems that your hate has grown through the thread - by constantly re-iterating the same thing it has enhanced your negativity you have made your point...............as someone said go get some fresh air |
05-09-2012, 07:57 PM | #328 | |
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Get it? |
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05-09-2012, 07:58 PM | #329 | |
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Also, my opinion of Damien as a person has been pretty consistent for the last eight or nine years, so not sure what you're talking about. |
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05-09-2012, 08:01 PM | #330 | |
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No, that's actually quite outrageous. He makes music you love so you defend his asshole personal/professional actions. That's exactly the really really awful, battered-woman behavior I'm specifically talking about. |
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